I just wish the Strokes would give Bob Pollard his due

Picking on the Strokes = 2003.

And if the Strokes are Duran Duran, the Battles must be...

who fucking cares.

i'd rather listen to pissed on demo tapes by the strokes than anything by post-modern dickless wonders like battles.

speaking of a-fire...uhhhmm is there any chance of a summer arcade fire show in nyc?

battles are totally and completely ripping off animal collective now. but the difference is that battles' vocals are hideous. what a fucking snore.

why do they have to make it one band vs. another? Pretty silly. Just listen to the music that you like and live longer.

the UK is all about band wars

Dear Franz Ferdinand,

You are irrelevant. Tom Verlaine has more talent in the hair on his balls than your entire band combined. Good luck selling more of your songs to future installments of Dance Dance Revolution once your 15 minutes are up. Marquee Moon is a timeless classic. Your albums will be forgotten in ten years.

If The Strokes are Duran Duran, Franz Ferdinand is A Flock of Seagulls.

Of course Franz aren't influenced by Television. That's because Franz sucks.

duran duran is playing a secret dance party tonight sponsored by AEG Live.

Art Burt ripping The Stone Roses..truely laughable

To say that The Strokes is "post 9/11 party music" is not fair and ill-advised. To say a human tragedy started a movement or scene that "co-opted" another scene ......... this dude took the media hype, or specifically NME, back then waaaay too seroiusly. And saying The Strokes were "rich kids" .......... like the dude above said, "so 2003".

Well if you want to get technical about it all, only one member of the strokes was the child of the head of a supermodel agency. Other than that the guy from Battles was pretty much on target in many ways. The Strokes were rich uptown kids whose punk cred was manufactured. Although I do like their music and i like battles also, the guy was not so far off the mark. Although I do remember the halcyon days when Albert Hammond Jr was a clerk at Kim's Video and not the ubiquitous leech at every rock show in town.

Oh and the Franz vs Paul war is not real but something started on here by people comparing their shows. That battle was won by Franz on that night.(now watch the macca buttsniffers go nuts)

i really felt that the strokes ushered in the era of hipsters going to dive bars.

it's true though, about the strokes. and it's not said enough.

I'm with the dude from Battles. Albert Hammond's solo stuff is a lot better than The Strokes'. I've never liked them.

You could also argue that Anthony Braxton's son (Tyondai Battles) got a look for a record deal because of nepotism.

The door swings both ways.

Isn't anyone gonna talk shit about Trust Fund Kid Collective, I mean Animal Collective?

not to mention that Ty Braxton is the son of Anthony Braxton, so it's not like he really had to struggle much either

Albert Hammond > The Strokes? hahaha. So wrong.

wow, people get really hung up on the situation that people were born into, as if they were given a choice

anybody know what time albert hammond goes on tonight at webster?

battles are bullshit

Actually a pretty thoughtful observation, and Battles a pretty thoughtful people, whether you like their music or not.

I'll make a few observations and let you all flame the piss out of me.

1) Julian gives Bob Pollard MAJOR props. Likes to say it was GBV that "discovered" them, and GBV is in one of their vids. So, wish granted.

2) The Strokes have been pushed as a very new york band. Yes, they're from New York. But the strokes represent New York like Tarzan represents Africa.

3) That's a good point about being born rich. No they didn't have a choice. But they certainly have choices since then, and this is where the whole punk ethos comes into play for me. If there was ever anybody who didn't need a major label apparatus to make and sell music, it's these guys. Yet what did they do? Signed to a major and ever since we've heard some pretty funny stories about breakdowns and pressure and lagging sales and all too much time on a tour bus, etc...My point, if I had independent wealth and fancied myself punk or DIY or whatever you want to call it, I would do exactly what I fucking wanted to do and nothing else. They didn't have a choice about being born rich, but they have every choice in the world about their music, since they don't have to struggle to eat, to pay for rehearsal space, to record and write and buy and maintain instruments. So, why did they choose to jump into the machine? That I will never understand.

Time for some good ol' fashioned answer records.

I've actually never heard/read The Strokes trying to convice anybody that they are a punk or a DIY band. They are just a band that makes music. Major labels offered them money to make music, they accepted. What's so wrong with that? It's better than pretending they aren't rich and trying to be something they are not, no?

also, what is this machine you speak of? Where can I buy one? Does it make hot dogs?

Battles who?

It makes me so mad when I hear that claim about the guys from the Strokes being nothing more than rich kids from Upper Eastside. If you were alive and breathing in the Lower Eastside from 2000 to 2004, you probably sat next to one of the boys at a bar and found out they were nicest, most down to earth guys ever. Or saw them kicking around Avenue A.

I always laugh when the critics and tastemakers make claim that they were self conscious fashionistas. I think one summer Julian had only two outfits, one being the ripped green army jacket and jeans. Nick seemed partial to his striped blazer.

If you want to talk about slaves to fashion, i remember the second day of the black out, when it was sweltering 90 degrees out, seeing Carlos D in his SS gear and combat boots walking down the street. I think everyone he passed by muttered under their breath "what a wanker. Trys to hard."

Moreover, they have alway been great to the people they have met along the way. With their albums, they would make the habit of employing them over those suggested by their label.

Actually, back in the day, they really made the East Village worth living in....

Battles...makes me wanna rap.

Agreed with Anon 4:41...at least about Casablancas. Talk about a humble, down-to-earth guy (at least in every interview I've read). I respect the shit out of any guy who wears the same outfit for a week straight.

Why do these musicians have to say that another band sucks? There is really nothing more boring to me than hearing people debate which band is "better"...art is art, and last I checked, it's the most subjective thing human beings experience. To think that some people -- both the musicians and message board posters alike -- are so thick-headed in thinking their opinions are facts (and that their perception of reality is the only right way to view things)...it's just mind-blowing. These debates are just ridiculously juvenile.

I dunno Drugs...maybe because they were interviewed and asked what albums they think are overrated?

I would agree though that people need to accept that people can like or dislike things for whatever reason they see fit.

huh so the strokes are now a prog band?

What was that ruckus about a Duran Duran Secret Dance party? Is someone pullin' on me leg?

Besides the Strokes, other bands that got ripped in the article were Nirvana, the Beatles, Beach Boys and Pink Floyd.

I'm pretty sure all of them are going to be ok.

It makes me so mad when I hear that claim about the guys from the Strokes being nothing more than rich kids from Upper Eastside. If you were alive and breathing in the Lower Eastside from 2000 to 2004, you probably sat next to one of the boys at a bar and found out they were nicest, most down to earth guys ever. Or saw them kicking around Avenue A.
<---- I could not agree more. And has anyone heard the original demos that got them signed? It's got THE SAINTS written all over them. They are the one band that makes this town worth living in. Get that Battles kid to the dr. he's got athlete's foot of the mouth!

The whole Franz Ferdinand "15 minutes are almost up" thing is getting pretty fucking old too. Just shut up and wait until they're up, then - shouldn't be long, no?

Kapranos didn't actually say Television sucks. He just said he "admires" Marquee Moon more than he "enjoys" it. In relation to the other comments, his were actually pretty measured in their criticism.

I have no idea why he had to bring the Strokes into it, though.

It makes me so mad when I hear that claim about the guys from the Strokes being nothing more than rich kids from Upper Eastside. If you were alive and breathing in the Lower Eastside from 2000 to 2004, you probably sat next to one of the boys at a bar and found out they were nicest, most down to earth guys ever. Or saw them kicking around Avenue A.
<---- I could not agree more. And has anyone heard the original demos that got them signed? It's got THE SAINTS written all over them. They are the one band that makes this town worth living in. Get that Battles kid to the dr. he's got athlete's foot of the mouth!

when people are all "should i move to NYC?" i just shake my head and link them here

I think The Guardian article wasn't about the typical "war bands". Something pretty common in the UK. It was about don't agree with the so called "sacred cows". A good theme if you ask me because there aren't anything more rebellious that someone who said to hat the mythical great thing. The oposite is a retrograd old band saying they hate all new acts and love all classic bands (Example, Oasis).

Of course I don't agree with all those opinions but that's not the important thing. The thing that matter it's that someone dares to say that the Sgt. Pepper wasn't so great or that Nirvana was overrated.

The Strokes aren't exactly "sacred cows" so I guess they inclusion could be called a "war band". And about Franz Ferdinand vs. Television. I think it's not something new, Alex Kapranos said that before in an early interview. But do you really think he is attacking Television? He only said they weren't influenced by those bands and that he thinks Marquee Moon is boring. I remember an article written by Alex for Liberation, the French newspaper. He said in it that they influences were bands like Ramones, Talking Heads, David Bowie and Roxy Music. He described those bands like "acts so intelligent that didn't care if everyone thought they were dumb" so guess that's the difference between FF and Gang of Four and Television. FF is against solemnity.

Anonymous @ 4:38 said "I've actually never heard/read The Strokes trying to convice anybody that they are a punk or a DIY band. They are just a band that makes music."

This is exactly what I was thinking. I avoided The Strokes the first time around, but I have recently been enjoying Room on Fire a fair deal - ignore all of the hype, and just appreciate it for what it is. Note that the guy from Battles doesn't say a word about their music, instead, he rants on about "scene... blah blah blah... NYC... bank accounts... blah".

As for the commenter above who said that they shouldn't have signed to a major label, I believe Isaac Brock said it best:

"I like keeping the lights on in my house. People who don't have to make their living playing music can bitch about my principles while they spend their parents' money or wash dishes for some asshole."

Perhaps Julian et al weren't interested in living off their parents' dough for the rest of their lives.

"when people are all "should i move to NYC?" i just shake my head and link them here"

now that was pretty good.

how about the oil-tycoon heir Win Butler? if we are going to write about artists who write about suffering yet have a completely privleged exsistence -- might as well throw him under the bus

as well as the trust fund collective

who the hell cares if people are born with money? i will never understand why this is brought up every single time the strokes are mentioned. they write good songs. they freakin rehearse their asses off. they tour hard. THEY ARE A DAMN GOOD BAND. if you dont like them, dont listen to them. no one is forcing you to. but stop hating because they are wealthy...they have worked just as hard as any band out their on their last two albums to stay where they started off. so how about talking about that for once. and as for albert. he started at the bottom all over to tout his album. touring the small clubs incessantly. recording in a small local sound studio on the LES. gaining the help of his closest friends for the album. when it comes down to it they work hard. so maybe you haters hate them because you cant stand to say you actually secretly like them.

its a whole lot easier to take risks on a music career when you know -- hey if it doesn't work out i can just "work for my daddy downtown" or one of his friends etc --

i second the other anon who said battles are bullshit. arrogant math rock pricks if you ask me. oh wait you didn't. BUt I said it anyhow.

"touring the small clubs incessantly"

I applaud him for playing Mercury before Bowery before Webster Hall, but let's not kid ourselves.

The one seriously idiotic part of that article is the ex-Sugababe harshing on Abba. "Arrival" is a great, great album. It's a conversation decider.

i hope ian williams gets hit by a bus

yeah, the strokes were ALL so rich that one of them couldn't even go to brown despite being accepted because his parents couldn't afford it. this ian williams idiot better choose his battles wisely.

"when people are all "should i move to NYC?" i just shake my head and link them here"

hopefully, we scare them off. because the housing market is plenty tight as is.

Hollywood Ian Williams has a cameo in "High Fidelity." No joke.

no one in nyc wanted to dance right after 9/11

ok, so is that battles' guy whining 'cuz the strokes have more attention, better looks or are welthier than he is?

Guess he's jealous they can actually write a song.

Say what you will about the Strokes' image, "Hard To Explain" is a pretty perfect song. And they were a breath of fresh air when Godspeed! You Black Emperor and Sigur Ros were the coolest things in underground rock music. Not to mention it was around the time of Storm and Stress, Iam Williams' band after Don Cab. Hoo boy. Snooze alert!

this Strokes quote comes from the guy who led the silliest Yes tribute band of 1995, currently leading the silliest Yes tribute band of 2007. The Strokes have much more interesting enemies than this. Also, anybody who uses the words "millennium," "downtown," and "co-opted" unironically has bigger problems than shitty music.

Lots of people (not me) admire Marquee Moon more than they actually like it--typical of Alex K to admit it instead of lying about it. and I'm sure he doesn't call Nick McCarthy "our regular guitarist." (Get well Richard!)

"a label offered and they accepted:"

hahahahahaahahah!hahahahaahahaha1HAAAAAAAAA!
oh, that's funny, yeah, that;' exactly how it happened! hahahahahahaa!
oh, that's good...

I guess my point was, if i had means, the last thing i would do is sign a contract that obligates me to sell a million record for a multi-national conglomerate...and then bitch to the press about how tough it is to be a star...but it does make good copy, the tortured artists, the rocker, peering out the tour bus window at the endless ribbon of highway wondering what happened between now and rehab...no, the strokes didn't orchestrate this, but their label sure did.

unfortunately, green gartside's arcade fire blurb accurately describes the last scritti politti album, which is why it wasn't any good..."I find it solidly unattractive, texturally nasty, a bit harmonically and melodically dull, bombastic and melodramatic, and the rhythms are pedestrian."

The Battles boy has obviously been sitting on this incredibly original and unprecedented Strokes blurb of his for 5 or 6 years, looking for a place to post it (without updating it)… if only he’d heard of blogging. Then he never would have had to form a crap new prog band to get the message out.

Serously. I haven't thought about the Strokes in years but I think I'm gonna put them on tonight. Thanks Battles guy!!!

i think i feel like Alex K on this. I think i'm supposed to like Battles but i can't dance to their music. i'm supposed to dislike Strokes, but damn its some hummable chummable fun...

p.s. take that "thoughtful observations by bands" to the toilet and flush it. every single band out there has something that someone could nitpick about. and i don't think that an upscale lineage is something worth discrediting - i can name a lot of bands that BV and BV readers probably love that were started by rich kids and relied on their $$$ and contacts to get to peoples' ears and ipods. but i don't really enjoy killing idols. so yeah... "thoughtfulness" --> toilet --> shove it.

the strokes couldn't fall back on rich parents.

julian and his father hate each other. his mom was a model and his stepdad an artist... meh.
i think nick's mom owns a resturant and his dad died when he was 12
albert and fab might have had money to fall back on;i doubt albert's dad has that much money anyway (check wikipedia)
and nikolai's mom was a schoolteacher and his dad a security guard for macy's. really loaded.

I love that all these comments revolve around the Strokes. I like the Strokes as much as the next guy, but Pet Sounds was ripped on. Pet fucking Sounds! Say what you will about the Strokes, but they will never release an album half as amazing as Pet Sounds. And who are the Kooks anyway? An article like this gives musicians from flash-in-the-pan bands a platform to utter absurd opinions such as these.

I agree completely with Ian Rankin about Velvet Underground and Nico. Nico is an atrocious singer. Somehow that gets ignored because we have somehow come to this universally held opinion that everything that the Velvet Underground did were brilliant. Not so.

That's true, Nico didn't really wasn't at the level of the rest of the band, but the way Warhol kind of forced her upon them kind of adds to the history of the album for me. Oh, and "I'll Be Your Mirror" wasn't that bad!

"Venus in Furs" and "Heroin" are among the best songs that I have ever heard. If there's an album that's a sacred cow, I think that it's this one.

PS: I still like White Light / White Light better!

Shoot... White Light / White Heat!

Nico made it acceptable for whispy-voiced girls to sing offkey. Pretty influential, I'd say.

yeah and Battles's video game music soundtracks are just so much more insightful and meaningful than the "new form of hair metal." three cheers to haters who make heartless music. white people like to dance too. thanks.

1. What's with all the people not being okay with someone's opinion? The guardian asked, people gave it.
2. How come no one's upset over Craig Finn calling Jim Morrison a drunken asshole? I mean...maybe he was.
3. What's with all the Battles haters?

Battles vs Strokes = NYC vs NYC = more fun.

anyone go to albert's gig last night?

if so, any changes & additions, setlist-wise (covers, strokes, new material)?

is the frank black tune still being played?

I've never heard anyone call a studio Abba album "classic," have you? Sure, their comps are great (GOLD rules), but single albums? Not so much.

Talk about one envious, misinformed, and reactionary generalization, which, as with all such run-on sentences, is designed to do nothing but bring attention to its author (for lack of an accurated term).

Also, it is fucking hysterically funny for Ian to go on about decadence; especially when rock (or country, or punk, or any other genre) has never been about choirboy and choirgirl behaviour.

Regarding the Strokes, Hammond, Jr. and Valenti have evolved and share one of the more creative (and tight) guitar duos, Fab & Nicolai are a steady rhythmic foundation, and Jules - when inspired - has proven to not only be a good frontman, but one can also hear the Ian Curtis, Lou Reed, Joey Ramone (and so many other greats) in his voice and phrasing.

So, Ian, don't hate them because they're BOTH rich and pretty - with the bulk of that wealth being earned as a band, not as the misapplied label of Trustafarians - but rather, hate them because they've become one of the strongest, consistent concert draws in the industry: something your band will have to work very hard to become yourselves.

Anon 6:47, now you have. I think Arrival is a classic.

GIVE ME MORE PLEASE ABOUT JIM MORRISON AND THE DOORS

THE ABSOLUTE WORST...........

WHO CARES ABOUT THE STROKES.

I think this article accomplished its goal. Man, you people are really defensive about your Strokes. I mean, I own and love most of the records dissed here, but you don't hear me saying "you don't know Tom Verlaine like I do!!!"

and the guy who wished a bus hit Ian...classy. That's not overreacting at all.

my friend saw battles last night, i had her ask ian about the article

about the Strokes comments: Ian said the band was being interviewed by the Guardian - they were asked to name a record they hate, so they were looking through Ian's ipod. at first they said a band I can't remember - one that no one really likes. The guy interviewing was like "ohh hmm anything else?", so they mentioned the Strokes' first album. he said they actually like that album, but they thought it'd get a rise out of the British fans. apparently it did.

Interestingly, my reaction to both Marquee Moon (the song) and The Strokes 1st album was pretty much the same. After about 10 minutes, you forget it's even playing.

My favorite strokes moment was playing the newly downloaded "is this it?" fresh from the internets (when it was released in Britain, and got a whole lotta hype), and mixing in a shit recording of myself playing bad stones riffs on an badly tuned guitar to a bad back beat as track 5, and giving the whole thing to my predisposed-to-be-loving-the-strokes friend. I thought we'd have a laugh, and he'd say "wow, what the hell was that?". But when I saw him again, I asked him how the Strokes are, and he said "man, it's so awesome. Beginning to end, not a weak spot anywhere."

That's when I realised that even if the Strokes weren't bullshit, alot of their fans devotion was.

its a whole lot easier to take risks on a music career when you know -- hey if it doesn't work out i can just "work for my daddy downtown" or one of his friends etc --

-It's been stated before, Julian and his father don't get along. I don't think he had a cushy corner office waiting for him at Elite, just in case the band fell through. Julian worked at a bar, Albert worked at a video shop and Nick was a waiter before the band got big. They all had jobs, none of which included suits and six figure paychecks. I know Nick and Julian both took college courses and Fab was studying sculpture as well. Get your facts straight, son.

The Strokes do take the Subway. I rode the 1 with Julian a little while back. He got off at Columbia and met up with Regina Spektor.

battles. right.

where the strokes are from and what their parents do for a living is so besides the point. it has nothing to do with the songs they (or he, being JC) wrote.

so tired of hearing that same old sob story, how they were given a band like a suit and a record deal like a bottle of vodka in some posh nightclub.

get over it ian williams, your just not as pretty. that hurts right?

go write a song.

ok, people can get mad at the strokes because julians dad whom he loathes created elite model management, but its completely fine for emma roberts, jamie lynn spears, ashlee simpson to become musicians/actors...doesnt make any sense? i dont care what anyone says, the strokes are talented, hardworkers, witty, handsome, stylish, creative. wealth or not. they ALL ride the subway, my friend has seen nikolai pushing his daughter in a stroller twice, etc etc. and that would be really stupid not to take a great offer for a record label, they are humans, they wont decline it just to rebel against a certain image. and personally they are above this foolish blog bickering(as it is apparent i am not). they are mature, most have quit smoking/drinking, have families and relationships, but keep their number one priority music. they have all had their fair share of problems: julian and his father havent been on speaking terms, nicks dad died at a young age, nikolai is diagnosed with a disease (and the whole band waited a year to start touring so he would get better). they are all best friends with eachother, and genuinely enjoy being in eachothers company, and most importantly making wonderful music. some creep whose band has not yet earned the respect the strokes deserve cant just expect to come onto the scene and insult bands with stories and who have underwent an assortment of experiences. the end