Yeah right

matt mcdonald, you're my hero.

Blood, sweat, tears....and who you know. Which mainly, is all its about anyway. And that CMJ CD that they send out is basically a pay for play scheme from what I've heard. Yeah, I know its all part of the business...but sometimes its such shit.

there's a big misunderstanding I always had about CMJ. I used to apply every year and never get in. Then it was pointed out to me that CMJ is a network of showcases and everyone tries to fill their showcases with their friends/connections/favorites, etc. So, the way to get into CMJ is by finding someone who is putting together a showcase. The booker at the club you play most might help. Or whoever you work with at ASCAP or BMI might help, etc. I guess CMJ lets some people in on blind submissions, but to my knowledge, I don't know a single band who has gotten in that way. and of course, talking to your connections doesn't cost $35.

As someone who used to work at CMJ, and sat next to the dude who would listen to artist submissions for hours, I actually believe that they do listen to all of the artists who submit. No doubt that the company is ultimately all about the money (not the music, that's for sure) and I'm not one to defend them of all of their practices (I think many of them suck), but I believe in this case they are telling the truth. Another former employee and I discussed this and we predicted that the very reason cited is the reason there were no listens counted.

Since we're spillin' beans today....

...another yucky CMJ band nonsense tidbit is that local or just plain unknown bands who DO get accepted for a CMJ showcase slot are then responsible for getting their own gig! Yes!

So if you're a NYC band who draws well at Galapagos but lousy at Cake Shop might best push the Galapagos booker to include the band in its CMJ show lineups.

(No reason to pick those two clubs, they were the first ones in head)

i still don't see how this crappy site should exist when there's myspace

It would be an intersting study to see how many bands CMJ accepts on "blind submissions." Meaning bands that aren't on hot indie labels, bands that don't have blog buzz, bands that aren't paying for ads in CMJ, or bands that don't hire radio promotion companies. I'm talking about bands that send out their own releases to press & radio and book their own shows and go to record stores trying to get their music in on consignment.

In answer to your question, looks like CMJ booked quite a few blind submissions from Sonicbids applications last year:

http://www.sonicbids.com/ItWorks/event_view.asp?event_id=503

i'd kinda like to see the list of bands complaining and take a random sample of the music.
I think that the main criteria to be selected for a showcase is to be A GOOD BAND. I'd bet good money that all of the bands snubbed were not very good. Or, they're basement artists who've never taken much time to book shows and get noticed.
In this day an age of instant exposure, the cream floats faster than it used to. So if you're "undiscovered" after years of working at it, perhaps it's time to really listen to what you're doing.
I'm not saying that a connection here and there couldn't help, but I seriously don't believe that success is solely "who you know", especially in DIY rock.
As the carnival barker once said "you pays your money, you takes your chance"
that application fee never claimed to guarantee anyone anything.
Do your best. If you really believe it's worthwhile, someone else will too. If you're blaming the world for ignoring you, or trying to make music that is 'marketable' by someone elses standards, don't be surprised if you don't get very far.

share your thoughts. call robyn. :oh whoops, i forgot the BCC:

>>Robyn Baskin
>>Showcase Coordinator
>>CMJ Network, Inc
>>151 W 25th St, 12th Fl
>>New York, NY 10001
>>917.606.1908 ext 273
>>fax: 917.606.1914
>>**2007 CMJ Music Marathon: October 16-20**

Yeah, well it looks like CMJ booked a ton of those Sonicbids bands last year, and I heard somewhere that they booked more than 500 this year, but i haven't seen a full list.

And gimmabreak, that's not true about the sole criteria of booking an artist for a festival. With all due respect, I think saying that booking a "good band" is a bit simplistic... people will disagree as to what "good" or "band" is... a lot of festivals try to book a lot of different kinds of things, some you may like, some you won't... there are hundreds of artists, for instance, at SXSW, which is so much fun, but you wouldn't like EVERY artist you saw there.

hamsterdance

matt mcdonald is an honest, hardworking guy.

true about SXSW, but the bands represented there are judged by someone to be worthy. And imagine the thousands of bands NOT booked to play.
And neither of those showcases is actually a festival.

CMJ sent out a memo to comment on this

^^ Where Can I find it this memo? ;-)

The CMJ 'Marathon' sucks anyway. It gets worse every year. I mean, who are you really excited to see this year? And the speakers are horrible. Both attendees and bands are shelling out A LOT of cash to come to this deal, at least they could do is pay some bigger bands/speakers to come. And don't get me started on the whole badges/admission thing...

That list of Sonicbids bands that got accepted into CMJ last year is somewhat misleading. Don't you need to go through Sonicbids in order to officially apply? I assume that some bigger bands get shows other ways, but I also saw a fair amount of established and hype bands on that list, implying that they happened to have Sonicbids accounts, but they weren't random bands who just happened to apply and get in.

anyone else notice that most of the best shows year after year are unofficial?

8:25 - no you don't actually have to be entered to be accepted. have a big enough buzz and all the work is done over the phone with the manager/booker/promoter. i have nothing but love for matt, pete, and robyn, but come on, the business is all schmooze!

And everyone is acting *SO* surprised at this? Come on.

In response to the comment by ++ (14 posts above this), I could understand if CMJ didn't accept bands who have at least some kind of buzz. In this day in age, blog buzz is a viable way to get attention and it's not that hard to do. The method of going to stores and getting your music in on consignment is kind of gone now...the music business is digital. While music is about art, the music industry is about business AND art. I'm pretty sure that CMJ gives all applicants a fair chance. Having used Sonicbids before as both an artist and a promoter, the amount of submissions that you can get are overwhelming, and after listening to band after band, things start sounding the same. It's just like A&R at a label...you're only going to choose something that really jumps out at you.

my band applied to cmj by mail, not by sonicbids, and we never heard anything back. (wtf?) we're a new band, not on a label, have minimal to nonexistant blog buzz, and we only have a demo, but we have a big draw most nights. (ok, fine, i get it, no cmj for us.) but then we ended up getting booked for an official showcase by the guy who booked our last show, because he likes our live show, and we're on a bill with other really good local bands we know personally. i have no idea who "cmj" is, i just know this cool guy who booked us. we should have never applied and spent the money - it's much more work the effort to cultivate relationships, ie, yes, schmooze. and practice.

Indeed CMJ IS about money and connections first and foremost. As the lead guy for an up and coming rock band (big black nun) years back, my management secured slots 2 years in a row at CMJ very easily. As a solo indie ant-folkie makin all the calls and submissions on my own, (and doin much more interesting stuff!)
I was not considered for any slots anywear , 2 years in a row.

I got a comment on my blog, Pampelmoose, how Sonicbids bands are accepted by CMJ. A link was provided so I checked it out and then found a lot of dead links to the more famous bands. Here's my response - "Maizie, that’s fabulous did they all get to play? And why are the most famous artists’ accounts all deactivated? The Black Angels, Architecture in Helsinki, Mute Math, Princess Superstar, Eleni Mandell, Dr Dog - were they all Sonicbids members at one time? I’m clicking away here but not getting any love from artists I want to hear….I suspect those artist were picked outside of the Sonicbids cattle call, yes?"

Here's the link in question:
http://www.sonicbids.com/ItWorks/event_view.asp?event_id=503

I never heard back from Sonicbids.

Dave Allen, http://www.pampelmoose.com

Looks like Sonicbids has posted a reply.

http://www.sonicbids.com/forum/topic_view.asp?topic_id=61815&page=1

Seems like an honest mistake, a horribly unfortunate one, but an honest one none-the-less. I consider it a non-issue at this point. The hit counter was screwed up, big whoop.

If you got rejected, it's probably because they didn't like you, so grow up.

"That list of Sonicbids bands that got accepted into CMJ last year is somewhat misleading. Don't you need to go through Sonicbids in order to officially apply?"

There's a mail-in application, too. So you don't have to do it on Sonicbids if you'd rather send a paper copy and entry fee.

bullplop

The stuff does get listened to...but it's by people that have no influence over what goes into the official showcases. These festivals, including NEMO, CMJ and SXSW, rely on application fees to pay a bunch of upfront costs before they can reel in sponsors to make their real money. Yes, thousands of dollars comes in from bands, good and bad, that have no chance of making it regardless of how good their music is but there's no grand conspiracy here. Sonicbids was a great idea when it started but now it enables every guy with four-track to submit his "band" for every opportunity that comes through so it's become pretty much impossible to break through the clutter. Sorry guys, there's just no way around building up a local following that will make money for the venues...when people will pay to see you, you will be accepted to these showcases.

So the deadline for SXSW is coming up. Every band from my state who got an official showcase last year was on a recognizable label. There were better bands, and more popular bands that didn't make the cut.

So is there any point in applying if you don't have a label, a major booking agency, or a major PR firm pushing for you?

And, how much does the deadline really matter? I remember a couple of years ago there was a one-month-old Austin band that got an official showcase. So it didn't exist when the deadline came.

I don't feel like sending $30 for a lost cause. Or should I do it just in case? The artist I work with is good enough to make the cut, but is that enough?

Rumor has it that Sonicbids has been abusing the rights of a lot of small businesses in the industry, in ways that violate federal law. they don't say anything because they don't want to be legally harassed by Sonicbids.

They better hope for there sake this is not true, or it might just legally come back and smack them in the face, very soon.