duh. any the guy couldn't pay, what, $70k in back rent? sheesh.

uh, merchandising!

you guys probably think chuck taylor is living off his pension too!

OMG HEZ LIEK A SELOUT

why is anyone suprised that he has millions? those cbgb shirts are urban outfitters and just about every other store...

urban outfitters = millionaires

what a jerk. if he had millions, he could pay his rent. The landlords, by the way, were some homeless non-profit. I'm sure they could have used the money.
what was the point of those save CBGB shows for? Where did that money go?

one of the things I always thought was awesome about CB's was that their "office" was right in the club... you paid to get in at Hilly's desk (or whoever else used it) so that picture of him in his office is really the entry way to the club..... maybe there was another office tucked away somewhere....not sure... but I'd like to think it all happened right there..

yeah, what a cheap fuck.

The question is, why did he need assistance with rent when the business was so successful? This had less to do with gentrification than it seems, IMHO.

Well, who really knows the whole story...being "worth" millions and having millions can be two different things. You could have assets worth millions but still owe alot of money & said assets would have to be sold to actually cash in, which might not be as easy as just having the money in the bank. He certainly didn't spend much on the bathrooms there.

Where are all the numbnuts who wanted the city to step in and save CBGB now?

^ wow...

is anyone really surprised? the CBGB shirts are at every mall in america. i didn't think for a second that this guy was broke and that he couldn't afford to pay the increased rent. he just used it as a ploy to line his pockets even more before he abandoned the club.

City Slickers 2: The Legend of Hilly's Gold

No one killed CBGB's except Hilly

he probably made a few hundred thousand off all the publicity from the club's closing alone.

i knew ian mckaye was onto something when he refused to participate in the "save cbgb" hoopla.

Hilly was rich. NO SHIT! How could he NOT be rich?
I've been disgusted by those CBGB benefits for years.

"fuckin jewbag"

I didn't know Mel Gibson posted here. Go fuck yourself, you ignorant waste of space.

"fuckin jewbag"

I didn't know Mel Gibson posted here. Go fuck yourself, you ignorant waste of space.

cbgb's was loosing money not Hilly. If one of your businesses is failing you can only tap into your own money so many times. duh

That's the point - he didn't care if the place closed. He just wanted the chee$e. You don't need a forensic accountant to know the guy raked in millions on those goddamn shirts. What's worse is how all the saps "came to his rescue"!!. Stupid-ass benefit shows, bullshit! Notice the Talking Heads didn't... still remember how he stiffed them over and over long ago. They could see right through that heartstring-tuggin' garbage.

Rest in peace, you miserable old fuck.

I prefer "Diamond Merchant", thank you very much!

Hey, that's my line!!!

"

"fuckin jewbag"

I didn't know Mel Gibson posted here. Go fuck yourself, you ignorant waste of space.

"

HAHAHHA YOU ARE MY HERO

I thought it was well known that CB's was closing because he wanted to shut it down and re-open it in Vegas. He was sick of New York and wanted to move west. Everything else was just posturing. Hilly was only going to keep it open if the city gave him some ridiculous sweetheart deal like making it a landmark and practically absolving him of having to pay rent at all...

From fastnfabulous.com:

After scoping out sites in lower Manhattan with no luck, Kristal decided to re-open CBGB’s in Las Vegas. A location was reportedly being eyed near the Aladdin Hotel and Casino, at the 475,000-square-foot Desert Passage retail and entertainment strip. Kristal said he intends to take the spirit of the club with him as well, adding that the new location "won't be the same size or the same shape, but I am going to have all the things that matter there."

"I am taking the bars with me, I am taking the stage--I'm taking the urinal that Joey [Ramone] pissed in with me. I'm going to take a lot of things--anything that makes this place CBGB… a lot of bands I've talked to say they have no place to play Vegas on their way west to L.A., Tucson, Portland or Seattle. It wouldn't be as glitzy as the rest of the strip. Parts of New York are glitzy too. On the inside, it will be much the same. New York is getting too expensive. Las Vegas is very cheap and parking is much easier. I've had offers to set up other CBGB’s around the world. I'm not going to say from whom, but there may [someday] be a CBGB in South America or Asia. I'm not thinking like 50 or 100 of them, but quite a few if they can be done right.”

Of course he could pay his rent. But prior to the "closing" shows, the draw at CBGB was pitiful, so Hilly was losing money every month. So what if he could cover it by taking personal losses every month? He was actually doing that for years. As much as Hilly loved CBGB and what it stood for, it was still a business, a business that lost money, and a business that was going to lose even more money because of the increased rent. The closing shows were great, but CBGB's regular booking prior to closing was marginal at best--and no one went. It's so nice that everyone wears CBGB T-shirts now and rails about the good old times, but none of tjose assholes were supporting up and coming bands at CBGB by paying the $5 cover and going to shows. It's so easy to say "I loved CBGB" after the fact, but how many times were you there on a weeknight spending money? Not enough is the answer. And maybe CBGB sucked in the 1990s-2000s, but you can't have it both ways. You can only really have standing to bitch about the closing if you were there week in and week out paying the cover and supporting the club and the bands.

If you are simply bitching now because CBGB was some romantic concept in your head of "punk rock" or some shit, but you were not a regular, just shut up. It's great that you think Hilly should have spent every personal dime to keep a club open that you yourself didn't even support except with words now. Where were you on a Tuesday night whwn it mattered. Not at CBGB. And why should Hilly have to pay for your indifference?

Nice of you all to show up only whwn it became hip to care.

And this is not a knock at you BV. I highly respect what you do here, it's a knock at the hipsster mentality that it's time to take up a cause when that cause is at it's critical mass and becomes cool and not before. Wake up people. The fact that you are dissing Hillay because he didn't die destitute is pathetic. the man put his heart and soul into that club for many many years, and could have had a lot more money if he gave up on CBGB earlier.

Show some fuckin' respect.

But by all means continue to spend $50 per ticket on the bands you think are hip. because they must care about art so much more than Hilly did.

“CBGB” (very presumptuous choice of signature there), why is it unreasonable to expect the revenue from the T-shirts and other CBGB-branded merchandise to subsidize the club?

"Of course he could pay his rent. But prior to the "closing" shows, the draw at CBGB was pitiful, so Hilly was losing money every month. So what if he could cover it by taking personal losses every month? He was actually doing that for years. As much as Hilly loved CBGB and what it stood for"

the above is utter and complete bullshit.

CBGB's was an underhanded pay-to-play venue in its last dozen years or so. They couldn't give a damn about putting on good shows, they just wanted to do shows for bands whose backers could upfront buy-out 200 'tickets' that would never be claimed, in exchange for the "privilege" of being able to say they'd played there.

If Hilly Kristal truly, sincerely, believed in that ugly bastardization of what CBGB's once was, as you say, then I'm perplexed as to why.

The place made money on those ticket buy-outs, on tourist drop ins, and on t-shirt sales. They couldn't give a damn about promoting vital new music or serving a scene.

CBGB's should have closed years before they did, and it is deeply unethical that they effectively stole money from the community, and from bands, in the guise of "charity" "save-us-from-closing" benefit shows. That they effectively short-changed their landlords, a genuine charity, out of $70000, is despicable.

That said, that antisemitic comment above is disgusting. Anyone with those attitudes should be banished from the punk rock community. You make a statement like that and anything else you have to say is worthless.

"how many times were you there on a weeknight spending money? Not enough is the answer. And maybe CBGB sucked in the 1990s-2000s, but you can't have it both ways. You can only really have standing to bitch about the closing if you were there week in and week out paying the cover and supporting the club and the bands."

if CB's had given half a rat's ass about booking decent shows you would have had all of us there for the last two(!) decades. You didn't care, and we had no reason to go.

Lots of folks wanted to see CB's revived as a relevant indie venue over the years. We all believed in what it once was, it seemed like there was no logical reason it couldn't be good again.

Unfortunately, many people I know who TRIED to direct good shows towards CBGB's were rudely turned down, if they got any response at all.

Hilly and his daughter, who effectively ran the place, couldn't be bothered to pay attention to what was happening scene-wise and had no interest in trying to snag good tours as they came through, even when they were offered for the taking. Offers from outside promoters were shot down out of hand, if they garnered any response at all.

CB's sucked for years, and it was no-one's fault but the management.

I don't know much about the management, but frequented the place quite a lot in the last few years. I saw quite a few up and coming bands play there...and also saw a lot of "hipsters" there patronizing the club. You could always find people the likes of The Strokes, Moby etc. hanging out here on any given night. Regardless of whatever the finances may have been...it really was a unique place that will never be recreated. I had some great nights there, so fuck all this other BS.

5:22 I just wonder where you got that info there about the ticket buy outs and pay to play.

I remember Hilly saying or maybe it was on his website that all ticket sales went directly to pay the bands, and the club took the alcohol sales, thats it. That was how the money was split. And on many, many nights there were maybe 10 or 20 people there.

also to that person saying they were trying to book shows there, did you guys look for advance money? maybe thats why Hilly didnt return your call.

Finally, your personal money is not the same as your corporation money. If Hilly was pumping his personal money into the business which was failing (losing money every month) that would make him one dumb businessman. Lets see that poor homeless shelter owner open up his personal accounts and see how much money he made on that city/state supported venture he has there.

2:08 had it right. Why is it unreasonable for Hilly to take the enormous profits he made on merchandise from the club to pay rent for the club. Hilly's actions are particularly absurd when you note that his backrent was merely $70,000 (for at least 18 months of rent) while his profits on merchandise were several times that amount. The argument about Hilly taking money out of his own pocket is disingenuous. Hilly ran a business that refused to pay rent and sought out benefit shows to pay for the rent, but all the while he was making hand over fist over t-shirts promoting that same business. If I were that non-profit that owned the property, I’d consider suing to recoup the money lost. As for visiting the club, if they had any shows I cared about I would have gone, but for the most part, they booked shows for bands I was not interested in. If mercury lounge could book great shows, why couldn't CBGB?

"CBGB's was an underhanded pay-to-play venue in its last dozen years or so. They couldn't give a damn about putting on good shows, they just wanted to do shows for bands whose backers could upfront buy-out 200 'tickets' that would never be claimed, in exchange for the "privilege" of being able to say they'd played there. "

I can't speak for everyone, but I have friends who's bands played CBGB in the late 1990s and early 2000s and nobody forced them to buy a block of 200 tickets in order to book the show.

CBGB didn't owe any back rent. The owners made a mistake with the rent and CBGB wasn't liable for it. A judge agreed with CBGB, not the other way around.

Little Stevie Van Zant could have paid the back rent off with his payday from one episode of The Sopranos

why would you pay "back rent" to a guy who is extorting you? $45 grand a month? fuck you man! its the principle of the thing. this isnt fucking 5th avenue mega store, its a dive bar. no one will ever rent that place for that money.

"also to that person saying they were trying to book shows there, did you guys look for advance money? maybe thats why Hilly didnt return your call."

no, that is not the case. they did occasionally return calls to people whop tried to improve the place with better booking, but they would only ever allow shitty single band time slots on throw away nights.

Since they paid no attention as to who did well musically or even attendance-wise, it was impossible to work up to a better slot.

so it's not they ONLY booked bands that could buy blocks of 200 tickets - BUT - they only gave a crap about booking the bands that could. That was the business model.

sure as heck wasn't about booking GOOD bands. They simply didn't care what happened on their stage, good or bad.

The bottom line is bands who had a draw were allowed to rebook on better nights.
The 200 ticket deal is a total pisser. Whoever came up with that is clueless and I bet has never stepped foot in CB's.

"The bottom line is bands who had a draw were allowed to rebook on better nights."

not necessarily true, in fact usually not so.

"The 200 ticket deal is a total pisser. Whoever came up with that is clueless and I bet has never stepped foot in CB's."

again, wrong. I suppose you never noticed the pages and pages of night-specific "guestlist." These were the dummy names that people who'd done buy-outs would provide for who had supposedly bought these "tickets." None or very few of these people would ever come into the club, but their tickets were paid for, nonetheless. It was backhanded pay-to-play.

lists were will call tickets and guest lists. If you wanted to be on guest list prob the label or the band had to pay. Remember labels often wanted to use CBs to showcase their bands back in late 80s and early 90s. Remember for ex Gin Blossoms, Guns n Roses, Marilyn Manson, all those were label showcases.

But, this is not the typical night, that happened few times a year, usually you had no name bands. Anyone could play.

"Where were you on a Tuesday night whwn it mattered. Not at CBGB."

maybe because we didn't want to support some rich asshole who gave up on trying to have good shows a long time ago? That's why I wasn't at CBs...

Fuck him.

Fuck CBGB's.

Can we please stop talking about this marginally important blip on the radar of rock and roll? All dignity left the building decades ago when they booked their last relevant ba

well it does raise a question how he obtained such assets while running a supposedly money losing business. tshirt sales, and other licensing deals should be included in the business.

if he defaulted in his rent or was hit with unfair lease disputes with his landlord, there are ways to deal with it. you don't allow people to fundraise for a business that has the income and just refuses to pay the bill on grounds they're being cheated by their landlord. so something isn't right.

the other thing is, just because you run a historically important business doesn't give you a free ride. you have to be a smart business man and change with the times. they did get headliners all during the 90's, but they would book bands at random time slots shoved in between a bunch of jersey bands. groups like pavement, hole, etc. who had reached lollapalooza status were still playing cbgb's for a short period, but they'd be booked at 7pm or something, and most people never noticed because the advertising had 50 names for every night of the week crammed in there, and at that time, the alternative press, and flyers were the only real source of advertising indie tours.

so, where did all the fundraising money end up?