Posted in music on July 25, 2014

Grunge

Cubs fan Eddie Vedder made some controversial remarks this week about the conflict going on in Israel (and sang "Imagine" in response to critics). Fellow Seattle rocker Krist Novoselic, who in his own words is "Best Known For Playing Bass On All Those Nirvana Records", but "Can Get Into Wonky Politics," posted his own reaction earlier this week. If you missed it, it starts off:

Thank you Eddie Vedder for speaking up for peace in our world. Eddie has gotten some criticism over comments he made about the conflict between the Palestinians and Israelis. That situation has been messed up for so long, it is no wonder that even mentioning it is toxic. Let's face it, the relationship between the Palestinians and the Israelis is a disaster! I don't know how many times I have heard the same explanations and excuses and it matters not, there is a continuing catastrophe between those two peoples.
Read the rest with some videos at Krist's blog (where he also posted "Give Peace a Chance"), and check out his original, similar article that appeared in Seattle Weekly in 2009.

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Comments (82)

Lennon

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 11:33 AM

Conflict in Israel? It's happening in Gaza. It's Gazans that are getting murdered by the IDF. Seriously, what the fuck.

Posted by Gaza | July 25, 2014 11:36 AM

Rockets stop Israel stops... simple

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 11:40 AM

As in all world conflicts, I'm rooting for the side that isn't Muslim.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 11:41 AM

Well, brooklyn vegan commenters are really meeting that US status quo. Outside of your country, Israel is generally viewed as a painfully out of touch toxic state. Are any of you even vaguely familiar with the history of the region. For that matter, do you have even a faint grasp on the current situation. NO! You don't. You're comments are useless and so are you.

Posted by aahxzen | July 25, 2014 11:45 AM

Eddie Vedder, grunge, Israel, Krist Novoselic, Nirvana, peace, Pearl Jam, war

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 11:47 AM

^take it to gawker dawg

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 11:47 AM

Israel left Gaza. Hamas took over and instead of spending money to help their people they spend it on weapons to kill and attack Israel. They are the ones that started and they never stop. Additionally they carry out their attacks in civilian areas but Eddie has no problem with anything Hamas does. I always despised that band.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 11:52 AM

people sometimes confuse hamas with hummus, and that really irritates me

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 11:55 AM

The truth is in who's winning.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 11:56 AM

American liberals ALWAYS side with the unproductive loser, no matter what the issue. It's how they self-identify.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 11:58 AM

Rockets stop Israel stops is such simplistic bullshit. Palestinians will still be living behind a wall in deplorable conditions while Tel Aviv parties away blasting shitty techno music.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 11:58 AM

Somebody get Jah Rule to help me make sense of all this

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 12:02 PM

"Ishmael will be a wild donkey of a man; his hand will be against everyone and everyone's hand against him, and he will live in hostility toward all his brothers."

Same as it ever was.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 12:06 PM

Take away the superior AMERICAN firepower and see how long they last.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 12:08 PM

Thanks 11:40. I mean really what else can they do. Thousands of indiscriminant rockets. They are trying to stop the source.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 12:14 PM

Gaza was offered statehood. They refused..The rest is history

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 12:17 PM

I feel really bad for the victims in Gaza however they need to stand up against Hamas and denounce them. These folks voted in a known terrorist group to lead them. Enough is enough.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 12:21 PM

Anyone who thinks this conflict is simple is a fool.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 12:27 PM

Here is a thought. The US stays out of every overseas conflict from here on out concerning that region of the world and we become sustainable with the relationships we have with our allies. We dump all the refugees that want to escape their homeland (preferably the uninhabited middle of Australia-or Jersey) And pay the country/area for their allowance. With the money we spend warring with these nations and backing armies- that should be a drop in the bucket. The non-religious fanatics can escape their war torn country and we can let the rest of them fight it out-As its been done for ages. The main reason the regions of the middle east hate us is because he have constantly stuck our heads in their affairs and their animosity and hatred toward us has exponentially grown over the years since our interference. Now this will be horrible for many living in the area to overcome but no more horrible then the decapitations and bombings of schools that is going on as we speak.....then 50 years down the line when the entire middle east turns their gaze on warring with the west...we can nuke the whole population and not feel too bad about it, BV politics

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 12:29 PM

12:27 maybe you're the fool. Wouldn't have started if they didn't fly THOUSANDS of Rockets at Israeli citizens BEFORE Israel finally said enough is enough.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 12:33 PM

Islam isn't benign or willing to be static. America can't just not be involved.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 12:33 PM

Love the insanity and rhetoric on this food-blog. Way to be #1 guys!

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 12:35 PM

BTW 12:27 I have spent time in the West Bank and Israel. What have you done to further your understanding?

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 12:37 PM

The Left uses the word "toxic" when any sort of mention of Israel being a sovereign nation with a right to defend itself as much as the Right uses it when any sort of mention of the Palestinians being and doing the same.

Perhaps if everyone started putting pressure on *both* sides equally we might see some resolution here.

Posted by teenageoldman | July 25, 2014 12:41 PM

This would never fly but my solution. Israel offer up citizenship to all Gazans. They would be Israeli citizens, blockade and fences would come down and they would be free to live within Israeli borders. Hopefully then the Gazans could become productive working folks in a homeland country and contribute to society. They would have access to better things too. Win-win.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 12:48 PM

Because i'm sure that this is really about Israeli citizenship, and i'm sure that as soon as they get their government check all will be well.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 1:08 PM

"both sides equally" ends when those who start the aggression are not acknowledged as such and are not assessed a more severe set of expectations upon them.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 1:09 PM

Yipee

Geopolitics BV stupid style

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 1:16 PM

1:08 what's your solution?

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 1:23 PM

eddie and chris need to go back to college and take history again, make sure you know the facts instead of spitting out random facts the media tell you and learn the truth before you speak.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 1:37 PM

Only one possible solution to the conflict which is a two state solution with economic and security treaties as a prerequisite to Palestinian statehood and recognition. Extremists on both sides have dominated the discussion for too long because they have the loudest voices. I believe the average Israeli and the average Palestinian would like nothing more than peace and an end to this conflict. Krist is not taking a side in his comments, he is just speaking the truth which is that this is a situation that has gone on too long and is a tragedy. It would also be nice if people would stop confusing criticism of Israeli policies with anti-semitism. Plenty of Jewish Israelis (and other Jews from other countries) are critical of Israeli policies but that hardly makes them anti-semitic. Likewise for confusing Islam with politics.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 1:43 PM

12:02- finally, a good reference in this comment section. Well done.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 1:49 PM

I wish instead of firing rockets Hamas said..hey Israel! We know you exist and we have a right to exist too. What can we do to live in harmony?

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 1:50 PM

Two state solution was offered up by Israel in 2005. Guess who rejected it?!

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 1:52 PM

^ooh oh I know why they rejected it! They don't want to acknowledge Israel! Vicious Cycle

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 1:54 PM

I have two dogs, Big Triscuit and Lil' Triscuit

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 2:12 PM

You know why there isn't a Palestinian state right now? Because some Jewish nut assassinated Rabin. They were very close back then. Fanatics on both sides are ruining it for everybody. Same thing with Hamas -- they reject all plans because they don't want to recognize Israel.

I blame WWI for all of this. Bring back the Ottoman Empire!

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 2:39 PM

Neither side wants peace, the military industrial complex is always hungry and needs feeding.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 2:40 PM

the "state" of israel is guilty of war crimes and attempted genocide.

period.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 3:06 PM

^lol

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 3:18 PM

Hamas's charter calls for destruction of Israel. Start with that. then take into account the wars in 1948, 1956, 1967 and 1973, instigated by Arab nations intent on destroying Israel. How is a country supposed to react to rocket fire - from a position of weakness or strength? If Hamas had Israel's weapons, there'd be no Israel. Israel could destroy Gaza but b/c it fights w/ 1 hand behind its back and against a double standard, it needs to neutralize Hamas's firepower as effectively as it can w/ that in mind. Israel builds shelters to protects its citizens from rockets, while hamas use its citizens to protects its rockets.

Posted by anonymous | July 25, 2014 3:25 PM

^truth. The only thing Israel is guilty of is having a more productive culture.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 3:31 PM

A two state solution is really the only tenable and decent way to resolve the conflict but Netanyahu and Likud will not agree to an independent Palestinian state and Hamas refuses Israel's right to exist.

People on both sides are captive to their own regimes' uncompromising, extremist policies and people on both sides are victims of violence perpetrated by the other side.

That said, Israel clearly has the advantage in power. Hamas's rockets and insurgents are no match for Israel's F-15s, Abrams tanks, Apache helicopters, and IDF troops. Few if any Israeli civilians have been killed by Hamas's recent rocket attacks while hundreds of Palestinians have been killed in Israel's retaliatory strikes.

To promote a two state solution, we need a new US policy. We can't keep sending $3 billion in aid every year to Israel and not expect anything from them in return. That just allows the conflict to continue.

The US should provide positive incentives (aid, trade etc) to BOTH sides to promote the negotiation of a Palestinian state that can co-exist with Israel. And we should impose negative consequences (the withholding of aid, embargoes etc) on BOTH sides if they persist in their nihilistic policies of destruction.

Appealing to people's self-interest (and desire for peace) will give them hope and a reason to moderate their positions. If they see a two state outcome as possible, they will shift their support from Likud and Hamas to more moderate political leadership. And with more moderate leadership, peaceful co-existence is possible!

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 3:35 PM

3:35 knows what's up

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 3:44 PM

Wow, and I thought I hated BV commenters when you were talking about crap like Dan Deaco!

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 3:45 PM

Maybe we should have some sort of festival over there? Grimes could play, and I bet the fellows in Deerhunter would swing by and treat everyone to some rockin' tunes!

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 3:48 PM

^i think if there is one person on the planet who could mediate this fiasco, it's Grimes.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 3:55 PM

The Palestinians/gazans are guilty of war crimes by first firing thousands of rockets unprovoked at innocent Israeli civilians. Period.

Israel is trying to eliminate the source of the rockets very easy to understand their position!

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 3:55 PM

^ agree 100%

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 4:11 PM

you people are so naive. You believe if there was 2 states there would be peace. Israel would continue to be attacked by those who will never believe it has a right to exist just as now in Gaza which Israel has give up all rights too.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 4:14 PM

Shut up 3:44, 3:35 is not some genius saying something that has not already been said about a million times over the last 10 years or more even. Yeah some genius he is. Of course that is a great idea but unfortunately the evil that the people in power on both sides, along with healthy dose of U.S. evil self interests, keep what seems like an obvious solution from ever happening.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 4:20 PM

Here's my two-part solution to the Israel-Hamas conflict:

PUT DOWN THE WEAPONS AND TALK.

No more people including women and children who are not Hamas are killed.

GIVE PALESTINIANS THEIR OWN STATE.

If there is no such thing as Palestine, why call them Palestinians?

Two states can co-exist peaceably.

'Bottom line is both sides need to stop fighting, start talking, and keep talking until peace is achieved.

Posted by D | July 25, 2014 4:45 PM

Two words: Hummus Rockets

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 4:55 PM

Palestine was the regions name. It's kind of like the New England of the Middle East

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 4:56 PM

When life begins with needles and pins
It ends with Swords and Knives
God save those born to die

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 6:21 PM

Ok 4:56pm so why not give them a state? What's the harm in giving them one? Oh, less power and $$$ for Israel, right.

Posted by D | July 25, 2014 6:39 PM

Kill all Jews and Arabs

Problem solved

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 6:47 PM

Do I believe if there were two states there would be peace? Hard to say until they try. I would suggest that a prerequisite to giving the Palestinians a state would be security and economic treaties between the Israelis and Palestinians and obviously the Palestinians would have to recognize that Israel has a right to exist. Self determination is a bitch when you think about it. The Jewish people were able to have self determination, so it's hard to argue the Palestinians shouldn't get a shot. Obviously the issue of returning to Israel proper for Palestinians who left (or forced out if that is your perspective) in '48 would also need to be agreed. Of course, doing nothing will just lead to eternal war as well as a convenient excuse for Arab states to blame everything on Israel.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 6:48 PM

the should just do whatever jersey republican thinks is best. that's a wise nigga.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 7:00 PM

Quiet, you filthy goyim! The Chosen People know what's best. Let The Tribe defend The Tribe (and its settlements) with U.S. dollars.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 7:09 PM

There would be peace if Palestine was created. Either Hamas would fold or be crushed by Palestine and Israel working together to crush them for continuing to kill people.


Posted by D | July 25, 2014 7:14 PM

D stands for dumb

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 7:24 PM

Supporting Israel is like supporting the war in Iraq. You can argue until youre blue in the face but you'll never stop being wrong.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 7:32 PM

Tapioca and the Flea: where do they stand on these issues?

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 8:50 PM

7:32 is so wrong on so many levels. I'm not even going to waste my time trying to teach him something, as I doubt he has completed 3rd grade.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 9:11 PM

How am I "dumb" 7:24pm? Read more books so you can have a greater vocabulary, with your tired-assed use of "dumb".

How so 9:11pm. You aren't teaching shit, you're just showing your inability to converse civilly and that you're a fucking child who resorts to ad hominem attacks when someone says something you don't agree with.

Israel is fucked up for killing women and children. Now say some shit about that TO ME.

Posted by D | July 25, 2014 9:25 PM

Support Hamas D since they definitely do not kill women and children.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 10:24 PM

^ They kill women and children, too.

Israel's government and Hamas are the real enemies of peace between Israelis and Palestinians.

Posted by D | July 25, 2014 10:42 PM

And that concludes another exciting hour of 'Perspectives' with Lionel Osbourne.

Posted by Anonymous | July 25, 2014 11:35 PM

Go tell your friends at Gawker you fucked up trannie. No one gives a fuck what your sociopathic brain thinks is true.

Posted by Anonymous | July 26, 2014 12:01 AM

^ 'The fuck are you babbling about?

Posted by Anonymous | July 26, 2014 12:04 AM

Israel is sowing the seeds of its own destruction.

Posted by Anonymous | July 26, 2014 3:52 AM

Boggles my mind that people think Israel doesn't have a right to defend itself from thousands if rockets being fired at its civilians.

Posted by Anonymous | July 26, 2014 8:40 AM

I agree^ every missle Hamas fired prior to the escalation was an act of war! They were asking for it and now they are getting clobbered! You can bet anything if any one person/group/country fired a missle at us we would retaliate quickly and heavily and that would be in reaction to just one missle!

Posted by Anonymous | July 26, 2014 10:49 AM

Israel will ride its "moral high ground" straight to Hell.

Oh, they don't believe in Hell? Well, they still have a wonderful future to look forward to.

Posted by Anonymous | July 26, 2014 11:22 AM

I refuse to acknowledge Fake D's right to exist. The Real D would suggest sending in the DMS crew to sort this out.

Posted by Anonymous | July 26, 2014 11:56 AM

10:49 well said!

Posted by Anonymous | July 26, 2014 12:04 PM

Only Israel is expected to accept a situation that no other nation in the world would accept or tolerate.

Posted by Anonymous | July 26, 2014 1:14 PM

Fuck the Jews. There nothing but a bunch of shits. They're kind of like the NYPD of the mideast. Hamas isn't much better. If they don't find a way to settle their issues without guns and bombs this is going to go until kingdom come.

Posted by Anonymous | July 26, 2014 4:01 PM

Wait, are the Palestinians STILL not willfully giving up their land, homes, and business to the Israelis? Come on Palestine. Just give them your shit so they can knock it down and their own people can move in. Don't you know how crowded Tel Aviv is these days? Fuck, give Israel a break. It's real crowded over there! And what with the hope that all Jewish people will someday come live is Israel, it's just not comfy, you know? I mean, who doesn't want an outdoor kitchen on the patio? But man, patio space is limited! Quit being dicks and just give Israel your shit. Anything they want. And stop being so mad about it. Stop with your dinky rockets that pretty much always get blown out of the sky before landing near innocent people, stop running around on the beach kicking balls, stop throwing rocks at those nice IDF soldiers at the checkpoints. Just stop bitching, complaining, and letting out any pent up aggression. Jeez. The Native Americans just rolled over and gave the settlers all of their shit, and look at them today. Couldn't have gone better.

Posted by Anonymous | July 27, 2014 9:21 PM

Fuck religion.

Posted by Anonymous | July 28, 2014 1:00 AM

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