Entries tagged with: stage diving
bloody nose at LOA's show @ Starland Ballroom earlier this month
Stage diving is the hot topic of the week with Joyce Manor speaking out publicly against it happening at their shows. It reminded me of all the attention stage diving was getting after a kid died jumping off the stage at a Life of Agony show at L'Amour. I looked it up, and that kid was 18-year-old Christopher Mitchell, and the sad incident happened on Dec. 18, 1994, almost exactly 20 years ago. It resulted in charges (reminiscent of the Lamb of God situation), court cases, and made the NY Times. Not much has changed. Here's an excerpt from that 1996 NY Times article:
...Bands welcome it, and in some cases, have come to demand mosh pits, as an energizing form of feedback from the fans. Audiences have taken to it as a freeing physical release.Read the rest in the NY Times.
"The kids would mosh to Paul Anka right now," said John Dittmar, president of Pinnacle Entertainment, a New York booking agency. "It almost doesn't matter what band it is, the kids want to get out there and move around."
Ron Delsener, a New York concert promoter whose company handles events at arenas like the Roseland ballroom and Madison Square Garden, said that moshing is to the 1990's what jitterbugging was to the 1940's. "Moshing is getting out your stress and tensions," Mr. Delsener said. "America is pretty wild these days. Now it is not only, 'I touch you,' but 'I push you.' "
Victims of moshing are increasingly seeking damages for their injuries. According to Entertainment Insurance Agency, which specializes in insurance for performing artists, concert venues and promoters, claims are about six times what they were 10 years ago.
"We've grown into a more litigious society," said Walter R. Howell Jr., who owns Entertainment Insurance. "A lot of these are mosh pit cases."
In the same year as Mr. Mitchell's death, two young men became quadriplegics as a result of moshing injuries, according to Crowd Management Strategies, and the Woodstock concert accounted for 7,000 injuries alone.
"It ranges from chaos with etiquette where the physical contact is light, to literally a raging brawl, where there are people in the pits who come to hurt people or to sexually assault women," Mr. Wertheimer said.
Those involved in the production of concerts, however, say security is usually good and that incidents associated with moshing are the exception, not the rule.
"Maybe you'll have a broken bone or two every now and then, but the real serious injuries that you see a lot of press on is not what is happening on a day-to-day basis," said Mr. Dittmar, the booking agent, whose clients include the Spin Doctors and White Zombie. "Is it a little bit more aggressive these days? Yes, but everything is more aggressive."
Life of Agony were never the same after they witnessed someone die at one of their shows (how are Miss May I and the family of Alberto Scott doing?). LOA singer Keith Caputo (now Mina Caputo) was/is always warning the crowd to be extra careful, including at their most recent gig which was a sold out, packed house at Starland Ballroom in NJ earlier this month. Despite the warnings though, not everyone walked out of the 2014 show unscathed. The girl in the picture above suffered a bloody nose, and one dude left with blood running down his face. Neither seemed upset though, and Mina later posted: "Girl breaks nose at gig last night, Boy splits his head! Sending U both love. i Feel terrible about it! Obviously last night was incredibly amazing! Dangerous & Inspiring #LIFEOFAGONY pits R like fuckn war zones, but ironically full of love. Unreal." Love was in the air (as was bassist Alan Roberts who closed the show as usual by riding for a bit on top of the crowd).
Since our last post about bands speaking out against stagediving, others have joined in the conversation too, like The Hotelier, whose singer Christian Holden told AltPress:
I hate stage diving both as a listener and performer. When I'm playing, I don't care about the spectacle of the "wild crowd" and more so just find myself worrying if the people up front are getting kicked in the face, if the smaller folks are getting crushed and if someone is going to trip on my cable and rip the head off my bass cab or step on our pedal boards. My energy onstage correlates to the energy in the crowd, and when I see that someone is annoyed because he or she is getting crushed, it bums me out. I'd rather see peeps in the crowd yell at a stage diver or let the person fall on his or her face. There is more power in small or shy people speaking for themselves and affirming themselves in the spaces they occupy.Andrew W.K. (who almost got sued for stagediving) and Dan Ozzi of Noisey "give you in the ins and outs on how to successfully stage dive and how to take part in a mosh pit", in the recent CoS video below...
by Andrew Sacher
Joyce Manor at Bowery Ballroom earlier this month (more by Mimi Hong)
Certain corners of the internet punk community have been up in arms this week after Joyce Manor "shamed" a stage diver at their Jacksonville, FL show this past Sunday (9/21). Themusic.com.au described the incident, writing:
The "grown man" in question -- got up on stage during one of Joyce Manor's songs and proceeded to stage-dive onto a group of young fans, overwhelmingly described since as being no older than high-school-age. Johnson, noticing the commotion, abruptly stopped the song and pulled the diver up on stage.They've also got a video of the whole thing going down which you can watch (starting at the 1:00 mark) below.
"Hey man, how tall are you?" Johnson asked the stage-diver. "How much do you weigh, if you don't mind me asking?"
Upon being told he weighs about 190 pounds (86 kilograms), Johnson turns to a girl in the audience: "How much do you weigh? Sorry, that's really rude. You're much smaller than him, right? It's completely unacceptable for him to impose himself on top of you. Completely unacceptable, right? Under no circumstances is that acceptable? OK."
[Barry] Johnson, though, sensed something sinister happening. He asked: "Ever been watching a sensitive pop-punk band," and "get your head walked on?"At Bowery Ballroom, he was met with cheers, but of course this is the type of thing that gets a lot of other people angry. Stuffyouwillhate.com called them "old men who don't understand the lifestyles of the youth." Idioteq.com wrote of the video of the Jacksonville incident, "No stage diving at punk rock shows?! Haha, you simply have to watch this video. Barry Johnson really embarassed himself with this cheesy move." Some people tweeted things like, "Seriously that infuriates me so fucking much Joyce Manor are a bunch of fucking pussies. Don't support them," or like, "Just saw a video of a kid getting thrown out cause he stage dived to Joyce manor. Fuck that band. Your supposed to encourage dives pussies," or like, "Lmao fuck Joyce manor, calling out a guy for stage diving." The Runout points to a screenshot of pop punk band American Verse posting, "Fuck these pussies. Stage dives forever."
...He noticed a few bad actors. He recognized the type, he said: "hardcore guys with Morrissey haircuts" who think nothing of "using a teenage girl's face for leverage" to climb on top of the crowd. "I'm not about that," he added. Indeed, at least two young women retreated from the center of the crowd clutching body parts in pain, though they both merrily returned.
Midshow, one of the Morrissey-haircut guys climbed onstage for the second time, and Mr. Johnson motioned to a security guard at the side, who chased him down and forcibly removed him.
Joyce Manor defended their stance though, tweeting:
Seeing a lot of people online saying I'm a "pussy" and a "bitch" for calling out that grown man trying to crush a group of teenage girls. So far on this tour I've seen a girl with a black eye, a girl with a concussion, and a girl with a dislocated knee. Great way to make young women feel safe at a show when the rest of the fucking world is hostile towards them already. I love a crazy show as much as any1 else I just don't think any1 should have to go 2 the hospital cuz of sum idiot w a tank top & Moz hair.Barry also added later on, "Not sayin every1 who stage dives is an asshole. Ppl been gettin hurt & maybe we should cool it? Myself included," along with a picture of himself stage diving with his guitar. Other bands took to Twitter to voice their support for them, including Balance & Composure, Candy Hearts, The Sidekicks, Code Orange, Spraynard and Touche Amore frontman Jeremy Bolm.
Placeholder's Brandon Gepfer wrote his own response on The Runout, saying:
I get that some people want to have fun, and I've been stage diving since 2006. I used to go to the Wonder Years' shows, too. It's totally cool. The line gets drawn, however, when the performer says that it isn't cool. Why is it so confusing, rather; why is it so outrageous to listen? At the end of the day, you are an attendant at a show and you made the decision to support a band. However, there are a number of people, including bands that call Barry Johnson from Joyce Manor a 'pussy' and say that's not 'punk rock.' You know what's not punk rock? A disrespectful teenager calling someone a 'pussy' because you disagree with their view point.Read the full, very interesting thing here.
This highlights the actual problem in punk rock. The attendees of the show think that they are owed something because they have an opinion. A lot of people got into punk rock because they were made fun of. I was called a 'pussy' from fifth grade all the way up until right now because of the opinions I hold, you know that simple opinion called equality. I hate the bro aspect of pop-punk and how these dorks infiltrated punk rock. The same type of people that beat me up as a kid listen to hardcore and punk rock now. They come to shows and hit people (not even dancing, just pushing each other for the hell of it), they jump off the stage literally every three minutes because I guess that's how they express themselves, I don't know.
The band's gotten support from many others too. Rookie Mag/Pitchfork Review editor Jessica Hopper tweeted, "THANK YOU @JoyceManor for respecting the rights and safety of show going teenage girl fans." Pitchfork's Ian Cohen tweeted, "@JoyceManor stays being the best." AltPress' Scott Heisel tweeted, "I stand with @JoyceManor on this one. Stage-diving = inconsiderate, selfish and potentially harmful. That's not punk." And plenty of others on Twitter expressed favorable opinions like "Thank you @JoyceManor Girls to the front!," and "Bless Joyce Manor's tweets right now. Fuck those huge dudes that stage dive & crush everyone in the crowd, especially tiny girls," and "Major respect to @JoyceManor, i was the one at fault for not giving a 200lb sweaty dude a boost up on my shoulders so he could crowdsurf."
People getting overly and unnecessarily rowdy and violent at punk shows has been happening since at least the '80s -- most people reading this probably know Fugazi is famous for taking a stand against it -- and of course this is part of why people feel confident refuting Joyce Manor by saying something along the lines of "that's just what happens at punk shows." But just because it's gone on for over two decades doesn't mean it's wrong to still take a stand against it. In 2011 I saw Screaming Females ask their crowd to calm down. After the crowd didn't listen and ended up breaking one of the band's drum stands, they walked off stage as at least one person sarcastically yelled "Fugazi!" at them. Earlier this year Titus Andronicus said something about it at a Brooklyn show and Joanna Gruesome did too. And it's not unrelated that Tigers Jaw and Pity Sex had to ask fans not to touch someone without consent, only for them to be made fun of much like Joyce Manor has been.
Watch the video of Joyce Manor's Jacksonville incident below...
by Ian Chainey (and Jonathan Dick, Wyatt Marshall & Scab Casserole)
Cancer at Maryland Deathfest
The 12th annual Maryland Deathfest, not to be confused with Maryland Deathscape, wrapped on May 25, bringing an end to another headbanging blockbuster. Though there were unforeseen cancellations -- Mitochondrion and Aeternus encountered visa/boarder issues, Triptykon attended H.R. Giger's funeral service -- the fest was another success, providing a four-day-long release for lucky metalheads and those following them on Twitter.
In fact, half the fun for vicarious attendees was keeping tabs on the travel to and from Maryland. Jonathan Dick, making his first trip to MDF, wrote a hilarious dispatch for Invisible Oranges detailing his experience with an eccentric woman aboard one of his connecting flights.
It was the greatest flight in the history of US Airways thanks to a passenger who I can only refer to as 33C. She essentially brought everyone on board into her conversational dimension of pretzel descriptions, the inadequacy of Subway sandwiches, and genuine concerns over who was "driving" the plane.His trials were paid back in full by a Thursday bill at Ram's Head Live that focused on the slow and low. Seven Sisters of Sleep, Whitehorse, Sourvein, Torche, Coffins, and Crowbar all crushed. Crowbar's Kirk Windstein even delivered a kick (see video below). It was a great way to grease the fest wheels, but IO editor Scab Casserole sensed a void. "Everyone's psyched, but the consensus on yesterday was that Triptykon was truly supposed to be the gem of last night. Their absence was felt." More from Scab's memories will appear later on this week at Invisible Oranges.
MDF got rolling on Friday, splitting bands up on four different stages -- Edison Lot A, Edison Lot B, Rams Head Live, and Baltimore Soundstage. The set-up was an improvement, according to Scab. "The new lot is impressive. Expansive, and comprehensive stage-wise. But it's super-hot."
This day, the blackened acts garnered the greatest response, as social media was flooded with kudos for Mgla, Taake, and the two-man Bölzer. Scab later said, "Taake fucking OWNED it. They might have been the best band of yesterday." Wyatt agreed, "Many wondered if the Norwegian band would make it into the US -- it was fortunate for those who were there that they encountered smooth sailing."
Agalloch played a set beloved by most, though the sound was mentioned to be muddy. Better things should be in store when they hit the road with Jex Thoth in June.
But, the death metal one-two punch of Cancer followed by At the Gates was an undeniable pinnacle. It had been a bit since both acts played the States and fans weren't left disappointed. And, lucky us, At the Gates' singer Tomas "Tompa" Lindberg was down to shed light on the status of the new album. All systems GO!
Speaking of fans, the event brought out its share of oddballs. If you had time between sets, people-watching was an attraction. If a Slayer trampstamp didn't display dedication, windmilling while holding crutches was a sure sign of devotion. Of course, then there were the Symbolic speedos:
MDF recap, photos & video continued below...
Miss May I posted the following message to their Facebook yesterday:
As many of you will have heard, Alberto Scott, a Miss May I fan in attendance at our Webster Hall show on Saturday night tragically died. We were deeply shocked and saddened to hear this news. We are awaiting a full report from the New York Police Department. In the meantime, we'd ask that all your thoughts and prayers be with his family. We have been made aware of a webpage that is raising funds to help pay for his funeral costs. We will be making a contribution and we'd strongly urge others to do so- http://www.gofundme.com/8vjoqcThe exact cause of death is still unknown but stage diving still seems to have been a factor. One commenter on the band's Facebook post wrote: :
I was there when it went down. I'm so upset that a young life was taken away because I remember him having the time of his life. He was stage diving like crazy. He died too young but I hope he died happy around his Miss May I family.Another says:
He did hit his head stage diving and seemed okay but honestly, until the ME report comes out we know nothing other than the fact that he is gone and everyone here is devastated.As mentioned in an update yesterday, the venue emailed us to say "the patron in question did not die while stage diving. The patron collapsed while exiting the venue, as video footage and the police corroborate."
Donate if you can. Rest in Peace Alberto.
A fan died at Rise Records-signed metalcore band Miss May I's show at the Studio at Webster Hall in NYC Saturday night (the same night Against Me! was playing the save venue in the Grand Ballroom), possibly after stage diving. Limited details have been released but the band posted the following message:
Hey everyone, we are aware of the incident that occurred at Webster Hall last night and will be posting a statement shortly. However, we are awaiting further information regarding the situation before we are able to make a full statementIn the comments of that post, one fellow fan wrote:
A kid stage dove and nobody caught him. He suffered a serious blow to the head and paramedics & doctors weren't able to save him. Club and show venues need to really enforce the "No stage Diving" rule so stuff like this won't happen. The stage is meant for the band to be on and the band only. R.I.P Alberto.UPDATE Webster Hall says that despite what people are saying at Miss May I's Facebook, "the patron in question did not die while stage diving. The patron collapsed while exiting the venue, as video footage and the police corroborate."
Sinestra Studios reports that he was 21 year old Alberto Scott and they've collected testimonials from those from the scene who knew him:
"The first time I met Alberto was around Veil of Maya in 2013. He was doing his thing and my first impression was "man, I do not want to get in there with that guy. He's like the terminator Kevin Hart." Then I gave him a pat while I went and did my thing. We talked for a bit and after that, I knew He was one great mosher and a very cool f**king guy from start to finish and I'm gonna miss those kicks he does when he throw down. The scar on my lip from his kick during The Word Alive's set at Memphis May Fire was an honor. R.I.P Alberto, You were a good friend. Stay moshing in heaven man."The picture above was posted by a Jenise Ramos Sarraga who also wrote:
This is the young man that died last night. No one blames the venue or the band, he lived and breathed Miss May I and truth is he hadnt been feeling well before the show. He was my daughters best friend and came home after this picture crazy excited. He even hung a dollar bill signed by [Miss May I vocalist] Levi. Until autopsy results come in no one will know what happened. All I ask is for prayers for his friends and family and that God provide a way to be able for them to be able to cover funeral expenses. No one thinks that they will have to bury a 21yr old. Miss May I made him happy. Thanks.Jenise has also started collecting money where she writes:
On 5/3/14 this vibrant 21 year old young man with a passion for Screamo music and big dreams went to his favorite band's concert and collapsed and died after dancing. His only family is his sister and her family who all live in Florida and are already struggling financially. Please consider donating to help this family say goodbye to a life gone way too soon. Any amount would help to ease this family's burden at this painful time. Thank you in advance.Rest in peace Alberto, and people be careful out there.
First of all, thanks to everyone who has reached out in support of Randy and each of us in this terrible situation. It's noted and very much appreciated.The band is also collecting money at Facebook for his "legal fund." Alleged video footage of alleged incident, below...
We have been keeping our heads down and not speaking out due to the fluid nature of the situation and the constantly changing information that even we receive daily.
Within an hour things can do endless 180's. It's maddening to try and make heads or tails.
We're taking the time to speak to you as it has been a significant period of time since this situation began and while nothing is immediately clear to any of us, we are not trying to keep anyone in the dark.
We have reached out and are making use of the resources we have acquired to help our brother who is still detained in Czech jail.
In the two years since, we were never notified of anything related to this incident.
Randy is our brother and we assure you, we are all staying very positive for him, working endlessly behind the scenes to provide any and all assistance possible.
The best we can do is to stay positive and continue to support our friend that we know is innocent.
We know that justice will prevail and we will continue to do our part to support our friend.
- LAMB OF GOD
As one of the self-proclaimed pioneers of stage-diving, Fishbone front man Angelo "Dr. Madd Vibe" Moore has been perfecting his form for more than 25 years.
But his diving produced an unwilling ripple in his human sea while the band performed last month at the World Cafe Live, 3025 Walnut St.
On Friday, a woman who was at that show filed a lawsuit against Moore, charging that he broke her collarbone when he launched off the stage onto the outstretched hands of the audience. Kimberly Myers, 42, of Voorhees, N.J., claims in the suit that she attended Fishbone's Feb. 23 show at the World Cafe's downstairs stage and that "without any warning," Moore dived off the stage and into the audience near where she was standing.
The suit claims that she also suffered a fractured skull, perforated eardrum and hearing loss and that she had to be taken from the venue by an ambulance. [Philly Daily News]
photos by Brian Woodward
"There were plenty of things those crowd-surfing at the Bouncing Souls show Thursday night at Webster Hall were wearing or holding on to that seemed like potential liabilities: glasses, hats, a backpack, a purse, a wheelchair.The Bouncing Souls completed their 2-night, 20th anniversary run at Webster Hall in NYC last night (Saturday, 8/21). The wheelchair incident happened on the first night, Friday (8/20), which is also when Lifetime and None More Black opened. More pictures and some videos from that show below...
During "Lean on Sheena," one of the Bouncing Souls' more agitated numbers, a few muscular young men toward the back of the crowd hoisted one of their friends, upright in his wheelchair, and thrust him forward. He rode the crowd, dozens of hands reaching upward to grip the tires, until he was deposited onstage, prompting the band's bass player, Bryan Kienlen, to exult, "That's Jersey right there for you!" [NY Times]
photos by Bao Nguyen
'my first time seeing black lips live and i never thought i'd see a group of energetic white teens mosh to a song about hurricane katrina.' - eric p
"Was anyone else shocked by the NYPD? I saw them arresting 2 hipsters, and the cops were quite aggressive and violent, like one guy was put down, and the other one had his arm twisted in his back and it looked painful. I am sure there were some kind of legit reasons for taking these hipsters away, but not so violently!!!" [pilou]Unlike Trail of Dead, but like HEALTH (and Grupo Fantasma) the Black Lips played a set at the JellyNYC Pool Party at the Williamsburg Waterfront on Sunday (7/26). Black Lips return to NYC in September to open for Yo La Tengo at Roseland Ballroom. Tickets are on sale.
In related news, the Black Lips are also now members of the Almighty Defenders supergroup. More pictures from the Watefront, the new video for "Drugs", and all tour dates, below...